Founded in 1978 by Jacques Herzog and Pierre de Meuron in Basel, Switzerland, the architectural firm was known in its early days for buildings that expressed character through their exteriors. Each design became a kind of essay on the architectural possibilities of a single material. There were no fiber cement panels. 1987 Ricola storage facility in Laufen, Switzerlandand stone-filled gabion walls, Dominus Winery in Napa Valleycompleted ten years later.
By the time the duo collaborated with Chinese artist Ai Weiwei at the Beijing National Stadium for the 2008 Olympics, they had created an intricate façade of steel beams known as “The Bird’s Nest”, creating a new kind of art. was an outstanding example of Along with Frank Gehry, Rem Koolhaas, and Zaha Hadid, famous architects who travel around the world. Today, the company has more than 550 employees in its offices and has completed a number of high-profile projects in the United States, including museum buildings in San Francisco, Miami and Minneapolis, and the Powerhouse Arts Complex in Brooklyn.
Born in the same year, 1950, Herzog and de Meuron met at the age of seven and later studied architecture together in Zurich. Mr. Herzog has been the face of the company for many years, playing the eloquent Penn in place of De Meuron’s normally taciturn Teller. Ahead of a major exhibition of Herzog & de Meuron’s work opening at London’s Royal Academy of Arts on 14 July, Herzog slipped out of the opening celebrations of the Venice Architecture Biennale in May. We sat at the bar inside the hotel. Wide-ranging conversations along the Grand Canal, Monaco.
Over tea, he discussed the upcoming Royal Academy exhibition. The exhibition traced back to the cerebrospinal cord injury clinic that opened in Basel in 2002 and focused in part on the company’s designs for hospitals and rehabilitation facilities, as well as discussing hospital risks. Working in a dictatorship and why he prefers to spend his time on Herzog & de Meuron’s smallest projects. Dialogue has been edited and condensed for clarity.
The conventional wisdom about architectural exhibits is that architectural exhibits are a faint reflection of the real thing. In other words, you can’t squeeze a building inside a museum gallery. I wanted to start by changing the question, what are you? can At an exhibition?
We give each building project a project number. The same is true for exhibitions. That’s part of the answer. It should be a project on its own terms. In our early exhibitions we tested different formats, for example having different photographers take pictures of the same building of ours.
In London I found another format. I received offers from 3 galleries. Each will be a completely different Mizan scene, a completely different design and a different color.
of advance materials The exhibition was “curated in close collaboration” with your firm, and describes Herzog & de Meuron as “one of the most respected architectural firms in the world.” Is there a danger in getting too involved, lacking curation or critical distance, or making the whole thing feel like a marketing exercise?
In fact, we curate our shows not because we want to control what people think, but quite the opposite. I don’t want to be too defensive. I am not a moralist. If I was trying to control everything, I would have chosen the wrong job.
The most egregious example of this dynamic that I can recall is: When the Frank Gehry retrospective was held at the Guggenheim Museum in 2001working with Gary’s office and at the same time a museum Worked to get city approval for gigantic new branch by Gary in Lower Manhattan.
I don’t have a political reason why I want the show to be ah, ah. I think it’s important to understand that people think very differently about what we’re working on. And that is the purpose of this exhibition. Focus on healthcare. It’s something that hasn’t really been presented in our work before.and what i did rehabilitation clinic Twenty years ago, this was one of our greatest projects of all time, yet it didn’t get a lot of attention. We also ran experiments at his three other hospitals based on its success in terms of how doctors and patients talk about it.
It is certainly a consensus among the general public that hospitals and medical facilities are among the worst designed…
It sucks!
why do you think that is?
neglected by architects. Hospitals are even worse than prisons. And as soon as people see it, it can get better. I am convinced that the construction of hospitals will become a big thing in the next 10 to 20 years.
Some architects, especially younger ones, are beginning to argue that virtually any new building is questionable from a climate standpoint. You have certainly put a lot of work into reimagining existing buildings. Do you think your office will focus more and more on this rather than foundation work?
It all depends on the legal terms. do they ask for this? The client or developer should then follow that guideline. As an architect, you can’t impose that. I think it would be interesting to discuss. Some architects believe, “If there’s nothing there, what do you say…”
pure.
that’s right. pure. I think it’s interesting if you take it more seriously. “What can I actually reuse?” You may not like what you have in your existing building because it’s outdated. But wait another 10 years and people start liking it again.
How does the Secretariat decide which projects to accept and which ones to decline? Over the past two years, we have focused more and more on this issue, especially since the start of the Ukrainian war. We had to give up a good amount of our work in Russia, which was very painful, not financially but in other ways. Architects don’t offer something like merchants. Build relationships with people. And we have established friendly relations with interesting Russian people.
After the war started, we canceled all our contracts there. We have stopped all these activities. And what will happen in China? What will happen in Arab countries? We were not open to different projects from different countries because we didn’t really understand the relationship between the West and these countries. As architects, especially in difficult countries, sometimes we are tempted to accept things because we have less criticism, more funding, and more ambition.
You have completed a series of very well received projects in the United States. Taken together, these are exceptions to the idea that European architects, and perhaps Swiss architects in particular, are in trouble in the United States because they lack the same attention to detail and rigor in construction. How have you addressed architectural challenges in the United States?
Probably my favorite new project at the moment. Calder Gardens, located in Philadelphia.A new platform to show [the sculptor Alexander] Calder’s work is made in a completely different way. He has great expectations for that materiality. We want to create stones that are artificial yet mimic nature. We look at how far we can go with what our local builders can offer without being very expensive.
In California, Dominus Winery is a good example. I would say one of our top 5. We invented rock walls like this. And looking back now, it still looks great. could we have known that? We were young architects. It could have collapsed and become a disaster.
There are currently 5 senior partners in the office. I’m interested in what role different partners play in each project.
The good thing about being an architect is that if you are in good health, you can work until you are quite old. I still participate in all kinds of projects. Some, like Calder, do little things, little things, pretty much everything. Of course not for large projects. Larger projects may involve me less than smaller projects. It’s absurd and contradictory, but it drives me forward. Pierre and I are completely different, so we work well together.
Why?
Pierre has always organized our business since the beginning. But it is not fair to say that Pierre is a businessman and I am an artist. Ideally, we go over projects together and discuss them with our partners. It strangely gives you some freedom as well, so you’ve reached the right size. It is not true that having a small office will give you more freedom.
Is there a limit to how big an office can be? Is there a number you can’t beat?
If we want to grow more, we have to give our partners more independence, and we have a New York office and a Hong Kong office, and I think they can be competitors. Not for us.
Are there any building types you haven’t tried yet that you’d like to try?
I am building a small chapel. It is called “Autobahn church” because it is near the highway. It is located in a remote area, deep in the mountains of Switzerland. I’m not very religious, but this, along with Calder, is my smallest and most beloved project.
Herzog & de Meuron
At the Royal Academy of Arts, London from 14th July to 15th October. Royalacademy.org.uk.
